Ferrari F1-75 Discussion Thread

[Gilles]

Agree 100%
Same position as you
Also know that the real order for this coming years could be seen only mid-2023 (long scenario)
Hope Ferrari could lead right from the begining, and more, but even if i kwow they have done their best, we know it is really ambitious
Also know that do not be able to challenge first place on the first quali would bring here a lot of deception

[patrese86]

We had to go for an extreme solution in my mind, we could not be conservative. If we went conservative and was middle of the road we would all be in uproar. That's not to say this solution couldnt backfire but at least we've explored the avenues and aren't going to settle for a solution which would leave us around the midfield. We will go out on our sword at least.

[Gilles]

Agree
I was expecting that knowing how hard they were working.
Whatever the first results, i will do my best to keep that in mind

[JacKy]

All i can see so far , every team had own ideas.

At the first glance some Cars looks similar but they are all different in details.

I am happy with the way that Ferrari took. We needed to be aggresive. Hope it pays out in the end.

Fingers Crossed!

[Gilles]

From the start i'm looking to the suspension arms (also steering ones)
They have done something particular here, with rear ones also. That could be as important as sidepods are, but more harder to copy for others. They really have done huge work, more than others, as expected
Attachment 7943
Also wondering if W13's doule spoon rear wing is not the cosequence of their large air box. The F1-75 could have found advantage in it, even if we could just speculate for now

[Gilles]

All i can see so far , every team had own ideas.

At the first glance some Cars looks similar but they are all different in details.

I am happy with the way that Ferrari took. We needed to be aggresive. Hope it pays out in the end.

Fingers Crossed!

Yes, but it mean that SF worked more than others, as we were saying for some time. This is the reason why we are expecting big progress this year, and the confirmation is if all teams had own ideas, that only SF show that reflection level, with all but a conservative car, that can be seen everywhere on the car (expect the same under the skin)
Aston impress me a lot also (even if they are facing bashing time), but i don't know if this team is able to level up its game reasticly

[Silent Bob]

Not sure what is so impressive about the Aston. Seems to be the most simple design and the one that looks the most like the FIA model.
As for the discussion about our front wing... in 2019 when we came out with the outwash wing, it was widely derided as the wrong path, but soon everyone had one similar. So I'm confident in the Ferrari aero guys.

[Kyss4k]

Not sure what is so impressive about the Aston. Seems to be the most simple design and the one that looks the most like the FIA model.
As for the discussion about our front wing... in 2019 when we came out with the outwash wing, it was widely derided as the wrong path, but soon everyone had one similar. So I'm confident in the Ferrari aero guys.

Really? It does not look anything like the FIA concept to me. The most radical thing about the Aston are those "flying sidepods". Creating a massive undercut.

[Silent Bob]

Really? It does not look anything like the FIA concept to me. The most radical thing about the Aston are those "flying sidepods". Creating a massive undercut.

So did the FIA model. Just a bit more curved. And without all the louvers. Not all that different. So far Ferrari and the AT look the most ambitious. Merc is impressive but looks like a development of last years car.

[Silent Bob]

I keep looking at those sidepods and realized they look a lot like spoon wings sideways. Wonder if they are supposed to produce downforce or just direct air. Cant wait for a proper analysis after testing.

[jgonzalesm6]

I keep looking at those sidepods and realized they look a lot like spoon wings sideways. Wonder if they are supposed to produce downforce or just direct air. Cant wait for a proper analysis after testing.

The sidepods valley of the F1-75 are to direct air and draw heat away from the cooling louvers down the side of the car and onto the lower wing beam of the rear wing. We've seen this before with the Mclaren MP4-26(2011) and the design of the air intake and sidepod which channels air along side the body and into the rear wing.

With regards to the cooling louvers of the F1-75, there are 3 or 4 horizontal louvers right behind the air intake (very hard to see) along with the vertical louvers that everyone can see......quite interesting.

Here's some pics of the horizontal cooling louvers.

https://cdn-1.motorsport.com/images/...ri-f1-75-.webp

https://twitter.com/JunaidSamodien_/...675520/photo/1

[PURE PASSION]

According to Motorsport. It the team had tried also Merc concept(extreme small sidepods) in the wind tunnel but they found 7% better aerodynamic efficiency in the current concept!!!

https://it.motorsport.com/f1/news/fe...otore/8315406/

[SS454]

According to Motorsport. It the team had tried also Merc concept(extreme small sidepods) in the wind tunnel but they found 7% better aerodynamic efficiency in the current concept!!!

https://it.motorsport.com/f1/news/fe...otore/8315406/

I'm not sure I believe that since there is a 0% chance that a whole different concept makes it to the wind tunnel. The decision to go the way they did surely was discovered in the CFD simulations. Maybe the article says wind tunnel just because people don't understand what CFD is though.

[Galvonero]

I'm not sure I believe that since there is a 0% chance that a whole different concept makes it to the wind tunnel. The decision to go the way they did surely was discovered in the CFD simulations. Maybe the article says wind tunnel just because people don't understand what CFD is though.

To those who don't know, CFD stands for Computational Fluid Dynamics... Mathematical simulation of Fluid mechanics laws and in formula 1 is used to simulate on computer models the same phenomenon that one would watch on a wind tunnel... The issue sometimes is getting an accurate correlation between the mathematical model and real model results.

[SS454]

To those who don't know, CFD stands for Computational Fluid Dynamics... Mathematical simulation of Fluid mechanics laws and in formula 1 is used to simulate on computer models the same phenomenon that one would watch on a wind tunnel... The issue sometimes is getting an accurate correlation between the mathematical model and real model results.

I was watching some behind the scenes F1 footage, and one of the engineers was saying how thousands of models (individual parts) get put through the CFD, and very few of those actually make it to the wind tunnel, and then only a certain percentage of those actually get built full scale (wind tunnels use 1/3 scale cars) and put on the car, and then not all of those parts actually work on the track.

It puts in perspective how much effort goes into every little part on a car and what it takes to evolve a car. Also it shows how valuable CFD time is, and now teams are restricted based on success.

[jgonzalesm6]

(wind tunnels use 1/3 scale cars)

Wind tunnels use 1/6 scale or 60% scale of the actual full size car as regulated by the FIA......fyi.

[patrese86]

According to Motorsport. It the team had tried also Merc concept(extreme small sidepods) in the wind tunnel but they found 7% better aerodynamic efficiency in the current concept!!!

https://it.motorsport.com/f1/news/fe...otore/8315406/

True or untrue we know that at Maranello we have been working on this for 2 years if not more because we had a delay of a year because of the pandemic and nearly flat out in 2021 we prepared for 2022 and we only upgraded the hybrid and the battery efficiency etc. we would of run every simulation with every concept and found the best results possible for our overall package, Including how we package the engine. I am hopeful but I guess all teams are because it is a bit unknown.

I actually fear more Red Bull than Mercedes because they is a reason they didn't show at the unveiling their concept. Newey is the aero legend

[PURE PASSION]

True or untrue we know that at Maranello we have been working on this for 2 years if not more because we had a delay of a year because of the pandemic and nearly flat out in 2021 we prepared for 2022 and we only upgraded the hybrid and the battery efficiency etc. we would of run every simulation with every concept and found the best results possible for our overall package, Including how we package the engine. I am hopeful but I guess all teams are because it is a bit unknown.

I actually fear more Red Bull than Mercedes because they is a reason they didn't show at the unveiling their concept. Newey is the aero legend

I fear allmost everyone under the new rules. For sure Merc and RBR are on the top of the fear list. As foe Newey ok has has proven his genious sever times ,BUT it doesnt mean that he always gonna deliver something extra special that will blow away everyone else!! In 2017 everbody where saying the same thing that they where expecting Newey to deliver big time ,and it turned out that Merc and we also had an equal chassis and sometimes even better. So yes i fear him but not so much more then Merc are perhaps someone else !!!

[PURE PASSION]

I just saw this tweet:
�� NEWS | Aerodynamic updates coming to the F1-75 in pre-season testing in Bahrain.

Source ✍️: (@Gazzetta_it)
and and the commentsv:
-I hope that doesn't mean that their aero turned out to be **** right now.
-Nah, from what I heard and read the floor that is on the car is the FiA-spec floor and not the actual floor they will be using

[SS454]

Wind tunnels use 1/6 scale or 60% scale of the actual full size car as regulated by the FIA......fyi.

Up to 60% or 3/5th haha. Basic fraction fail on our part lol. Thanks

[SS454]

I fear allmost everyone under the new rules. For sure Merc and RBR are on the top of the fear list. As foe Newey ok has has proven his genious sever times ,BUT it doesnt mean that he always gonna deliver something extra special that will blow away everyone else!! In 2017 everbody where saying the same thing that they where expecting Newey to deliver big time ,and it turned out that Merc and we also had an equal chassis and sometimes even better. So yes i fear him but not so much more then Merc are perhaps someone else !!!

The thing with Red Bull is their PU performance and packaging may not be enough to match their outstanding aero. I think for several years during the hybrid era, Red Bull had the best aero, perhaps the best chassis in general but just could not fight against the Mercedes PU. However now that Honda PU and Red Bull are all but one company, it means the PU packaging can be designed with the car, rather than the car designed around the PU.

[SS454]

I just saw this tweet:
�� NEWS | Aerodynamic updates coming to the F1-75 in pre-season testing in Bahrain.

Source ✍️: (@Gazzetta_it)
and and the commentsv:
-I hope that doesn't mean that their aero turned out to be **** right now.
-Nah, from what I heard and read the floor that is on the car is the FiA-spec floor and not the actual floor they will be using

I think every single team will be changing their car between their launch at the tests, and surely before the first GP.

[jgonzalesm6]

Up to 60% or 3/5th haha. Basic fraction fail on our part lol. Thanks

[Gilles]

Not sure what is so impressive about the Aston. Seems to be the most simple design and the one that looks the most like the FIA model.
As for the discussion about our front wing... in 2019 when we came out with the outwash wing, it was widely derided as the wrong path, but soon everyone had one similar. So I'm confident in the Ferrari aero guys.

The Aston impress me by the way they worked their heavy sidepods undercut or double floor, puting higher or maybe hhorizontaly their cooling components. Maybe not the ribest choice, but not completly the Fia way and somewhere brave. Like you i'm confident in the SF aero guys, but i have to say my kwnowlege in aero does not allow me to make grounded assessments

[Gilles]

I think every single team will be changing their car between their launch at the tests, and surely before the first GP.

Me too

[JacKy]

From the rumors: Seems like we've choose that sidepod design due to cool the engine more so it can reach its potential and somehow produced more Downforce than the other significant concept we've tried.

As we all have seen before back in 2011-2013 with the superior downforce and short gear ratios you can even won in Monza easily without top speed.

[Gilles]

I fear allmost everyone under the new rules. For sure Merc and RBR are on the top of the fear list. As foe Newey ok has has proven his genious sever times ,BUT it doesnt mean that he always gonna deliver something extra special that will blow away everyone else!! In 2017 everbody where saying the same thing that they where expecting Newey to deliver big time ,and it turned out that Merc and we also had an equal chassis and sometimes even better. So yes i fear him but not so much more then Merc are perhaps someone else !!!

Ok but few teams have state of the art tools to achieve the best possible job. Mercedes and RB of course, maybe SF now, others ?
Even if a midfield team find some genius thing, the big ones should catch them with updates (if budget cap permitting)
This was the story with Brawn GP, RB caught them

[patrese86]

https://www.f1technical.net/forum/vi...30249#p1034019

interesting view around the sidepod and "tubs" area. Looks like that approach alone reduces drag and improves downforce.

[SS454]

https://www.f1technical.net/forum/vi...30249#p1034019

interesting view around the sidepod and "tubs" area. Looks like that approach alone reduces drag and improves downforce.

While the model is really nothing like the actual car, it points towards some things that should be true. The big one to me is better controlling the wake towards the big fat rear tires which is source of enormous drag on an F1 car. I can't see how Ferrari's design isn't among the best, if not the best so far in this area. Mercedes obviously using their 45 degree angle off the front of the sidepod, but I'd like to believe Ferrari's idea is even better.

How much downforce the car produces compared to others, who knows. But the small, flat front wing, and sidepod that gets the airflow away from hitting the bulk of the rear tires, plus the huge slot gaps in the edges of the beam wing, and V shape profile of the rear wing. This all suggests the Ferrari may have a very low drag coefficient.

[paolo lalli]

Binotto states that ferrari will copy other teams.I do not believe this for one moment it is purely a diversion so other teams do not focus to much on the ferrari design its a small fake cry of oh we got it wrong again,I don't think so.