Russian GP 2019 Race

[darkchild]

But he didn’t have the pace to keep in with vettel on Softs especially. His pace was good on Mediums, but to judge it clearly vettel got DNF.

I think there should be talk clearly within the team & drivers before the race. When it’s 1-2, whoever have the better race pace will get the better race strategy that’s it. Whether it’s Lec or vettel whoever it is I don’t care. Just bring home the same 1-2 that’s it. Rather than expressing it on radio & other not obeying the orders clearly. This doesn’t work out for long run.
Mattia done excellent job till now, but it’s reaching high time now to focus on driver relationship too.

He was 1.4s off on lap 8th.

You cannot get into DRS range on this track driving a same car (duo to w 2 last corners).

Sainz said Merc wouldnt be able to overtake them had they have 0.5s additional pace here, which means without 1+ s in pocket its IMPOSSIBLE to overtake.

Vettel knew that therefore he wanted Charles to drive in his dirty air. He benefited from team strat last race when he was 3.5s behind before pitting in Singapore, so its not exactly easy to overtake same car and not cook your tires (look at Ham vs Leclerc in Monza).

[Lesky]

Really now....did anyone say Ferrari had the better car before the summer break? No, nobody did. Yes Mercedes had the best car before the summer break, nobody said otherwise and no need to waste anyone's time here.

But after the summer break and especially after the singapore upgrades, Ferrari now have the better car. You can twist as much as you want, but Ferrari won Spa and Monza fair and square. And they dominated Singapore and would've won today's race as well without the VSC. It's not possible to achieve this results without having a faster car.

Again, how do you that about Singapore when every car just ran in a train the whole race? Bottas ran fastest of the top team in singapore. Or today when everyone ran in a train more less as well. You are just assuming things because of the qualy results.

I dont know what you mean by "faster car", I have only argued the Merc car have better race pace, meaning if both teams would run an empty track, the Merc would have better tire preservation, thats the only thing we can assume because thats what happened the entire season at proper race tracks and not street circuits. (Spa and Monza included) You can kid yourself by saying Ferrari won monza & spar fair and square, which they did. That does not mean that Ferrari had better race pace than Merc, which is what I am arguing. We all know Hamilton would have won Spa had Vettel not been sacrifieced to ṕrotect Leclerc, Ferrari did a better job as a team than Merc, but they did not have a faster car in the race. Just benefited from the starting positions and team work. You obviously fail to see the difference, I have no idea why.

In general, it seems its hard for people to separate being fastest on a single lap qualy and a long distance race, I see the debate all over F1 website about it, people were going berserk already at SPA: "OMG OMG OMG OMG LEWIS HAMILTON ALMOST BEAT THAT ROCKET FERRARI CAR IN A MUCH SLOWER CAR AS PROVEN BY QUALY." And it was even worse after Monza, with people claiming Hamilton must be the greatest driver on earth because he could keep up with that Ferrari at Monza on a power track.

My point is that Lewis is not performing any miracles, he is just harvesting the Mercs race pace advantage, nothing strange there.

[19000rpmF-2004]

Lec was slow then vet, that was for sure. Some people want him to slow down and give him the place when Ham was just 2-3 sec back... so then Seb give the place and then get pass by ham and get cretizice anyways. The team help Lec anyways when they pit Seb. It was late and the slow him by 1/2 sec. more help then that he can get to get his place back.

[Vittorio]

It was a very unfortunate day for the Scuderia. And it all came down to luck - nothing more, nothing less. I don't believe for a millisecond that Mercedes had 'the better strategy'. They simply got very lucky when the VSC happened when it did in the race. It could have as easily gone the other way with Ferrari in the ascendancy had there been no safety car or had it come just a few laps later (or even earlier). Pure luck.

Also, Sochi is a crap track. Very glad that next year will see that last of it.

A few things did concern me, though:
1. Vettel's DNF. Should we be concerned about Ferrari's reliability? Even looking forward to 2020, that is very important, of course.
2. You either play the 'team game' or you don't. Enough said.
3. I'm concerned that Leclerc was never able to pass Bottas, let alone have any say in a win after the VSC. If he completely set up his car for qualifying, then that's a possible issue, both in terms of strategy and ultimate pace, and may explain his inability to pass Bottas.

Final note: No 'free' pit-stops should ever be allowed. including under a VSC - ever. I've never liked the concept, whoever the 'winners' might be. It's just arbitrary nonsense and no amount of talk about 'a risky strategy that paid off' will ever convince me otherwise. The pit lane should be closed the moment there is any safety car of any sort - simple as that.

A 'free' VSC pit stop is too much of a lottery and I don't appreciate lotteries in any sport.

[nani_s23]

Vettel & Charles ignoring team orders.
Charles Monza was ridiculous, vettel’s action today was not acceptable at all.

Now I’m starting to believe whats vettel statement “nothing is bigger than the team” after Singapore GP.
He wantedly push harder on his fresh set of hards to undercut Ham & also Lec. He tried to give it back to Lec for the Monza incident.
In today’s race, Lec was obeying to team & while vettel isn’t.

So it shows both are not happy with each other. This is where Mattia need to take the thing into his hands & talk with their drivers briefly.

I know no driver wants to be Bottas. Mercs have that flexibility.
As said earlier, it should be like where you are on the front row with your team-mate. The driver with better race pace should get better strategy. Else mercs are there to ruin P1 & P2 positions.

[Rob]

[Rob]

[nani_s23]

Lec was slow then vet, that was for sure. Some people want him to slow down and give him the place when Ham was just 2-3 sec back... so then Seb give the place and then get pass by ham and get cretizice anyways. The team help Lec anyways when they pit Seb. It was late and the slow him by 1/2 sec. more help then that he can get to get his place back.

Exactly, This is my point.
On the same note when vettel pit got delayed n came out behind Lec. Vettel agreed with the teams decision on radio.
Initially first 10Laps he was saying, not early swap as Lec is just too far we shall look at it after 10Laps he replied. By doing too early He would fall within Ham DRS range. as we know vettel gets intense in wheel-wheel battles. This was the input from vettel on the radio.

[Rob]

[Rob]

[TonyRizza]

In my opinion we would have won today if vettel followed the agreed plan, I doubt leclerc would have pitted so early if the team wasn't forced to undercut vettel

[darkchild]

We would have had 1-2 anyway you slice it without SC. I doubt Hamilton would be able to make up time and pass both of them in Sochi.

Duo to last 2 corners, it seems impossible.

[Giallo 550]

Gutted for the entire team, but at least we got a podium. This is not what I expected today, but that's racing.

[bonzo]

Lec should've hurried the pace in pursuit of Vet, forcing the overtake. Instead, he fell behind and wasn't even within DRS range. This team isn't really working as it should.

He would have ruined his tires if he did, this was not the plan, the softs should have lasted at least 20-23 laps for plan A to succeed. Seb did not drive to the plan.

[nani_s23]

He would have ruined his tires if he did, this was not the plan, the softs should have lasted at least 20-23 laps for plan A to succeed. Seb did not drive to the plan.

Vettel: It was pretty clear. I got off to a good start and I think I've kept my part of the agreement. This will be discussed internally. Then I felt comfortable, I could expand the lead.

[darkchild]

He would have ruined his tires if he did, this was not the plan, the softs should have lasted at least 20-23 laps for plan A to succeed. Seb did not drive to the plan.

That was Sebs plan. To not give place back but floor it knowing guy chasing you, if he were to stay under 2s, will ruin his tires.

If he stays (Lec did for 10 laps) he ruins his tires. He starts to fall back - "See, Im faster let me race".

Would be intersting to see Leclerc defending hard into T1 and not giving him space and then Vettel trying to catch up.

This two will be a headache in coming months and next year.

Vettel: It was pretty clear. I got off to a good start and I think I've kept my part of the agreement. This will be discussed internally. Then I felt comfortable, I could expand the lead.

So what was his part? Beat Hamilton of the line? Would be much better for everyone invovled if there was no plan. Maybe Seb would be able to extend his gap like in Singapore when he dropped like Charles did today during first stint.

[bonzo]

That was Sebs plan. To not give place back but floor it knowing guy chasing you, if he were to stay under 2s, will ruin his tires.

If he stays (Lec did for 10 laps) he ruins his tires. He starts to fall back - "See, Im faster let me race".

Would be intersting to see Leclerc defending hard into T1 and not giving him space and then Vettel trying to catch up.

This two will be a headache in coming months and next year.



So what was his part? Beat Hamilton of the line? Would be much better for everyone invovled if there was no plan. Maybe Seb would be able to extend his gap like in Singapore when he dropped like Charles did today during first stint.

With nothing to lose just let them race each other. As simple as that.

[paolo lalli]

No butler's at Ferrari 2 star drivers in a cutting edge sport I guess it says it all both want to win. Mercedes have destroyed bottas career playing with him like a puppet.The sad thing is he allows it.Butler or unemployed that's bottas choice poor beggar.The Ferrari drivers have fire in there bellies and both want to beat mercedes and Lewis.Merceses got lucky simple as that and totto wolf knows it.

[nani_s23]

That was Sebs plan. To not give place back but floor it knowing guy chasing you, if he were to stay under 2s, will ruin his tires.

If he stays (Lec did for 10 laps) he ruins his tires. He starts to fall back - "See, Im faster let me race".

Would be intersting to see Leclerc defending hard into T1 and not giving him space and then Vettel trying to catch up.

This two will be a headache in coming months and next year.



So what was his part? Beat Hamilton of the line? Would be much better for everyone invovled if there was no plan. Maybe Seb would be able to extend his gap like in Singapore when he dropped like Charles did today during first stint.

Generally undercut won’t work here. I think he mean, That early pit stop for Lec & late pit stop for vettel where Lec got ahead. That was the part.

I would simply put it in one way, vettel had the race pace he’s setting up his car for that.
Leclerc had quali pace. Both of them want to win a race that’s good for sport.
But internally creating lot of worrying signs within ferrari team.

[evo_spook]

No butler's at Ferrari 2 star drivers in a cutting edge sport I guess it says it all both want to win. Mercedes have destroyed bottas career playing with him like a puppet.The sad thing is he allows it.Butler or unemployed that's bottas choice poor beggar.The Ferrari drivers have fire in there bellies and both want to beat mercedes and Lewis.Merceses got lucky simple as that and totto wolf knows it.

He has had free reign at the beginning of the years, the simple truth is except for a few races he simply isn’t fast enough in races. He has great one lap pace but he works the tyres wrong.


This may clear a few things up

https://twitter.com/LukeSmithF1

Anyone wondering why Vettel didn't continue on with his car and parked up where he did: it was unsafe with the electronics, so had to stop immediately. Hence why FIA called VSC as well #F1 #RussianGP

[nani_s23]

Q: The race started well, a torpedo start.

Vettel: Yeah, don't mention torpedo around Russia. Because I have bad memories with Kvyat crashing into me

[nani_s23]

Leclerc says he saw no reason to fight Vettel at the start: "I trusted completely that we would swap after". Said earlier the trust is still there with Vettel despite today

Vettel version:
Vettel believes he honoured Ferrari pre-race agreement
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/v...mpression=true

Vettel: I don’t know exactly what happened there to be honest. I think we had an agreement, I spoke in particular with Charles before he race, I think it was quite clear. But I don’t know, maybe I missed something. Bitter today because we wanted to have 1&2.

Mattia Binotto version:
Binotto: "Seb had a fantastic start, he overtook Hamilton already before in Turn 1, Charles didn't give him the slipstream but Seb took it. We asked Seb to give the position because that was the agreement."

[nani_s23]

#AMuS Suzuka is now the the ultimate test for Ferrari.

Vettel: "For us it's the ultimate test of how the latest upgrades work and how much closer we are to Mercedes."

[tifosi1993]

It's pretty simple, if Vettel really wants to control the race by leading upfront, he should qualify on pole.

And to Ferrari, stop making things complicated. The driver with more points, wins, poles and podiums should be the defacto number 1 driver. And the driver who qualifies on pole should always get the optimal strategy. Enough with the nonsense.

[nani_s23]

Whether you think it’s a fuss over nothing or Multi 516, one thing is certain; Ferrari’s drivers don’t agree on what was agreed before today’s race.

Ferrari have got a car capable of fighting for wins for the rest of the year. Their fight is with Mercedes. Not with themselves.

[nani_s23]

It's pretty simple, if Vettel really wants to control the race by leading upfront, he should qualify on pole.

And to Ferrari, stop making things complicated. The driver with more points, wins, poles and podiums should be the defacto number 1 driver. And the driver who qualifies on pole should always get the optimal strategy. Enough with the nonsense.

I have a question here in the above case which you mentioned.
Example: If anyone of our driver Lec/vet took the pole n leading the race, 2nd position driver who is a team-mate lapping faster than leader. 3rd position driver from mercs is keeping pressure on 2nd position. What would the Ferrari team do ??
Taken into account, none of our drivers are fighting for WDC.
As per your statement, let leader control the race who is leading the points & sacrifice P2???

[nani_s23]

AMuS Vettel could face a engine penalty after his technical issue today. But not immediately in Suzuka.

Binotto: "Sebastian still has an intact control unit. If it was really only that..."

[tifosi1993]

The fact is, the fiasco in Monza didn't change the end result. Ferrari won that race with the better driver, Vettel on the other hand spun and earned himself 0 point. 100% his fault.

But today was different, thanks to the strategy he goes from P3 to P1. Anyone can see the race start, Leclerc didn't put up any fight whatsoever, he didn't even cover the inside line. It was a easy sailing for Vettel, and after that he refused to play his part.

Without the strategy, Leclerc would've fought hard to defend his position, as he has done in previous races.

[sreekant]

how many times will safety cars and protocols decide racing and championships in F1?? it's bizzare and not racing anymore...Hammy is in a sweet spot to win all this!

[sreekant]

it's VSC wins!