Scuderia Ferrari SF16-H Development thread.

[NyX]

From f1analisitecnica:
Ferrari will spend 3 tokens out of 9 to bring two new ICE with better combustion chamber, along with a new Shell fuel.

The turbocompressor will be fixed in Canada.

And some aero updates to the front of the car, but no S-duct.

[theodorefabrice]

Anrasp, there is a problem in your logic in my opinion. I can't say at the same time :
- that Mercedes is unbeatable on the basis of Hamilton performance
- that Hamilton was slower than Raikonen because of his damages.

[Kristof_F40]

Considering the fact hat Seb is already on his 2nd PU, and an updated version will be at Sochi, I find it strange that Seb would already be on his 3th ICE after 4 races..

[NyX]

Considering the fact hat Seb is already on his 2nd PU, and an updated version will be at Sochi, I find it strange that Seb would already be on his 3th ICE after 4 races..

Yes, they plan to go back to previous engines in tracks that engines are not that important like Monaco or Singapore

[Kristof_F40]

Yes, they plan to go back to previous engines in tracks that engines are not that important like Monaco or Singapore

Yes read it aswell.. Good thing they ignore the Bahrain problem with Seb and just follow their plan. In the end of the day, with the field like it is: if we would get 10 place penalty we would still be able to score a podium so.. Better to try and catch Mercs on performance

[GrndLkNatv]

Anrasp, there is a problem in your logic in my opinion. I can't say at the same time :
- that Mercedes is unbeatable on the basis of Hamilton performance
- that Hamilton was slower than Raikonen because of his damages.

Actually if you look at Bahrain:

Maximum speed - Qualification:

1st sector Vettel Rosberg 251.4 252.9
2nd sector Raikkonen Hamilton 277.6 277.7
3rd sector Vettel Hamilton 297.2 301.5

maximum speed - Race:

1st sector Raikkonen Hamilton 238.6 246.1
2nd sector Rosberg Raikkonen 254.7 256.6
3rd sector Raikkonen Hamilton 297.7 302.0

[Gianlu27]

La Gazzetta was the first to say important upgrades on the engine (and something for aero) in Russia, last week.

Motorsport this morning, confirmed Ferrari were working on combustion (adding they spent 3 tokens). It's incredible how Ferrari has been fast with the upgrades! Hope everything will be okay :)


For the rotation of the engines.. Seb should end the season with 5 engines

[fronaldo]

Wonder how much this new upgrade engines will bring

[Gianlu27]

Wonder how much this new upgrade engines will bring

I think it's focused more on reliability than on performance :)

[phsyklone]

Ferrari considers bold engine update plan for Russian GP

Ferrari is considering spending its first engine development tokens in time for the Russian Grand Prix in a bold bid to get its season back on track, Motosport.com can reveal.

Despite having shown strong pace in the first three events, Ferrari is yet to fully capitalise on that form and deliver a victory it so seeks.

But now, despite an engine failure for Sebastian Vettel in Bahrain that means he is already on his second powerunit, the Maranello outfit is weighing up a radical idea of introducing an updated third engine already.

Sources have revealed that Ferrari had unlocked horsepower improvements on the dyno and is willing to spend three of its remaining nine development tokens to bring the combustion updates to track already.

It is thought that both Sebastian Vettel and Kimi Raikkonen will get the new engine if the team decides to go ahead with its plan.

No downside

Although it would seem strange to have Vettel already put on to his third power unit of the five he is allowed this season, the reality is that a rotation system means there would be little downside.

That is because 30-40 percent of engine mileage is done in free practice sessions, where Ferrari can deploy the older specification of engines.

Furthermore, there are events – like the Monaco and Singapore Grands Prix – that are not so power critical so the newer units may not be so essential to be used there.

On the other hand, Russia is a power-sensitive track thanks to its long straights – and it is this situation that has made Ferrari consider a change to its plan.

Marchionne hint

Ferrari president Sergio Marchionne dropped a hint about the scheme in China last weekend when he suggested the team was ready to bring forward developments.

Reflecting on the season, he said: “Things are going in the right direction. We have set ourselves important objectives, but we must learn to know a completely new car, so mistakes are understandable.

“Despite everything we could have won in Australia, and in general I am happy with the progress.

“But we have much work ahead of us, and we will bring forward an important development. Also, we know that Mercedes will not stop developing, so we have no illusions that they will be easily beaten

[cokata]

Nah combustion upgrade + new fuel is for performance surely. They wouldn't change to a new ICE so soon if they didn't think that they have found a good step forward. I'm optimistic since we finally have a great chassis, and if the PU becomes competitive we are there.

[phsyklone]

Nah combustion upgrade + new fuel is for performance surely. They wouldn't change to a new ICE so soon if they didn't think that they have found a good step forward. I'm optimistic since we finally have a great chassis, and if the PU becomes competitive we are there.

Good point. I also think this will help compensate for turbo issues because now we'll be able to produce more hp even with a "sick" turbo

[PURE PASSION]

If we are actually have turbo issues,then why to spend tokens for combustion updates???
Isn't the turbo ready or we 're not having any issues in there????

[GrndLkNatv]

If we are actually have turbo issues,then why to spend tokens for combustion updates???
Isn't the turbo ready or we 're not having any issues in there????

Well if the combustion updates will bring you more performance now, allow you to win, and then only perform better with the turbo update, why not just go ahead and get started now..

[PURE PASSION]

Well if the combustion updates will bring you more performance now, allow you to win, and then only perform better with the turbo update, why not just go ahead and get started now..

Just asking!!!whatever make us faster,is fine with me!!!!

[cokata]

Just asking!!!whatever make us faster,is fine with me!!!!

http://www.f1analisitecnica.com/2016...-un-nuovo.html

The turbo fix is scheduled for Canada. The new combustion upgrade + fuel is said to improve mean horsepower as well as deliver more exhaust flow which should help with MGU-H recovery indirectly without changing the turbo design.

[f300v10]

Under the PU regulations you don't have to spend tokens to fix a reliability issue. If they are spending 3 tokens on the combustion chamber changes, its for performance. That doesn't mean they can't fix reliability issues at the same time. But they would not spend tokens on reliability alone as those changes are free.

It is a little scary if Seb does end up on PU #3 by race #4. But I think its worth the risk if it allows Ferrari to close on or better yet exceed the performance of the Merc.

[f300v10]

Speaking of PU perform vs. Merc, this video would seem to indicate the Ferrari PU and the Merc PU are very similar as the acceleration of Kimi and Hamilton is virtually identical:

https://mobile.twitter.com/i/status/...227200/video/1

[FerrariF60]

Under the PU regulations you don't have to spend tokens to fix a reliability issue. If they are spending 3 tokens on the combustion chamber changes, its for performance. That doesn't mean they can't fix reliability issues at the same time. But they would not spend tokens on reliability alone as those changes are free.

It is a little scary if Seb does end up on PU #3 by race #4. But I think its worth the risk if it allows Ferrari to close on or better yet exceed the performance of the Merc.

I personally think Ferrari know exactly what they,re doing
They want to close and like you said even surpass the performance of the Merc as early in the season as possible and like you said, if they are concerned of any reliability issues they'll be fixed using NO tokens for that matter

And if Seb will need to use a 6th engine towards the end of season I'm sure Ferrari will use one at a track where overtaking is much easier and if the engine will be that much better I'm sure if Seb starts 10th (assuming he'll be on pole) I'm sure he'll end up on the podium that race

But all in all I like the philosophy approach Ferrari is taking under the new management

Forza Ferrari

[GrndLkNatv]

Under the PU regulations you don't have to spend tokens to fix a reliability issue. If they are spending 3 tokens on the combustion chamber changes, its for performance. That doesn't mean they can't fix reliability issues at the same time. But they would not spend tokens on reliability alone as those changes are free.

It is a little scary if Seb does end up on PU #3 by race #4. But I think its worth the risk if it allows Ferrari to close on or better yet exceed the performance of the Merc.

I don't think it's scary at all, the engines would all receive the same amount of wear whether you use them for 5 races straight, or whether you space them out... Either way as the season winds down he will have less fresh engines, but in the worst case, he takes a 10 spot and then makes up the difference with acquired performance gain.

[KimiBot]

We shouldnt fool ourselves. That merc has a lot more in reserve than they are showing. Hamilton started from the back, had to do 5 pit stops, had a nose cone change.. and then ended up 7th. How many teams can do that? That merc is way ahead of the competition. We have a long way to go.

Arrivabene said that we are 0.1 sec behind Mercs, that was in some interview this week. I do believe him, we are close now.

Kimi was P22 after 15 laps and ended P5 in Shanghai.

Also in quali, Kimi was 0.05 after ROS after 2 sectors, and then he did a mistake in last sector.

[cokata]

Speaking of PU perform vs. Merc, this video would seem to indicate the Ferrari PU and the Merc PU are very similar as the acceleration of Kimi and Hamilton is virtually identical:

https://mobile.twitter.com/i/status/...227200/video/1

No that looks terrible. Kimi had a very healthy dose of slipstreaming from the Sauber infront of him and he was barely gaining on Hamilton.

[f300v10]

So you can do CDF analysis on the slipstream with your eyes? Very impressive. ;) The slipstream on an F1 car drops off very fast with distance and would have little effect until they are over at least 300 KPH. You can see at the end that Kimi does start to pull way once he starts to get the benefit of the Sauber up ahead.

[phsyklone]

Are these PU limited to 12k Rpm or 15k Rpm ? because almost all onboards I've seen these cars dont go above 12k

[SashAlex]

No that looks terrible. Kimi had a very healthy dose of slipstreaming from the Sauber infront of him and he was barely gaining on Hamilton.

It all started with Hamilton having a much better traction at the exit of the corner, hence better acceleration matched by Kimi with the slipstreaming on Sauber. So yeah, the comparison is not the best one right here.

[From Treviso]

Translated from http://www.f1analisitecnica.com/2016...-un-nuovo.html

GP SOCHI: from a high severity circuit for the internal combustion engine, designed by Hermann Tilke
The circuit along 5853 meters, is the third in the Formula 1 calendar in order of length, after the Spa-Francorchamps circuit in Belgium and to Silverstone in Britain. It 'was designed by Hermann Tilke as many other circuits introduced since 1999 in Formula 1. The Russian circuit has twelve right-handers and only six left. If the first sector it can be considered the fastest part of the circuit, the second and especially the third well are more techniques for the drivers and their respective cars. Predominate 90 ° bends from third gear with external high curbs and stepped touting much tires and aerodynamic devices.

From a more technical point of view we are talking of a medium severity circuit for the brakes, similar to the Shanghai circuit, while for the internal combustion engine will be back on a style Bahrain circuit, ie of high stringency where the recovery from MGU-H and K will still be crucial since we are talking about almost 3 seconds a lap of influence. In Russia it will count very much to have a really efficient recovery from MGU-H, the electric motor that can recover more than twice the energy per lap of MGU-K.

FERRARI TEAM: among the many problems we have not collected the expected results
Ferrari, due to various problems, in the first three races of the season has not collected the results that management had expected. In the first race of the season, thanks to an excellent start and without the red flag, Vettel could probably win the tender, with the other red on the track, Kimi Raikkonen, who was forced to retire due to a rupture of the impeller turbine. Bahrain Vettel was KO'd in the formation lap for a software problem while Raikkonen took second place without too much trouble the Mercedes of Rosberg. China Ferrari did not experience any technical problems due to the use of more "safe" mappings than those of Bahrain, not picking the best result that the car offered due to some mistakes of the pilots, both in qualifying and in the race .

FERRARI SF16-H: anticipated updates to the Power Unit for the assault groped to W07 Hybrid
Next Sunday it will race on a track that has always proved tricky for the Maranello car, but Ferrari has now surely the obligation to react and demonstrate that they have the speed to put least pressure the Anglo-German Mercedes.

To do that will be brought by the Italian Scuderia some aerodynamic updates to the car (important and eagerly awaited news on the front) and above will speak in advance of the road map planned earlier in the year, even on the Power Unit.

As we state for the past few weeks, Ferrari has major problems to the power unit that does not allow the SF16-H to fight on equal terms with the new, strong, weapon of Team Mercedes, the W07 Hybrid. To solve the problems described several times on these pages, to be able to take full advantage of all the horses of the new power unit of Maranello has been designed to introduce the updates in two main phases.
In Russia (the upgrade was originally designed for the Spanish Grand Prix) will speak on the combustion chamber while in Canada there will be some changes to the turbocharger group. These two important updates should go to resolve issues at the Power Unit which we already analyzed several times in previous posts.

[diego_alunan]

can't wait for the updates

[abbottcostello]

Are these PU limited to 12k Rpm or 15k Rpm ? because almost all onboards I've seen these cars dont go above 12k

The regulations limit to 15k, but in order to last to the end of the race with fuel they are all limiting to 11500 - 12000 rpm.

[cokata]

The regulations limit to 15k, but in order to last to the end of the race with fuel they are all limiting to 11500 - 12000 rpm.

That's false. The rules are made so that the max fuel flow happens at 10.5k RPM, and it can't go higher then that. Higher revs are less efficient so you will make less power with the fuel you've got also the higher the revs the less reliable the PU will be. The reason they go to ~12k is that when they shift up a gear they end up with ~10.5K RPM for the next one.

[Kristof_F40]

Actually if you look at Bahrain:

Maximum speed - Qualification:

1st sector Vettel Rosberg 251.4 252.9
2nd sector Raikkonen Hamilton 277.6 277.7
3rd sector Vettel Hamilton 297.2 301.5

maximum speed - Race:

1st sector Raikkonen Hamilton 238.6 246.1
2nd sector Rosberg Raikkonen 254.7 256.6
3rd sector Raikkonen Hamilton 297.7 302.0

Interesting. So it's probably true that we aren't using full potential during the whole race.
Why is the difference in S2 so big qualy vs. race?